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For the record -

Re: For the record -

Postby gman » Mon Aug 02, 2021 10:09 pm

boriselbrus wrote:
Anyway, I'm chucking a peel in the garden tomorrow just to settle this once and for all


Unless your garden is a rock garden at 900m I don't think that will prove anything.


Good point, I should really leave a few dozen banana skins at various altitudes and on different terrain types. If anyone sees one of these skins on a hill, can you please leave it in situ and post a photo here with the grid ref and date.
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Re: For the record -

Postby Kevin29035 » Mon Aug 02, 2021 10:13 pm

In the crevasse just under the trig on the Ben More, Crianlarich, yesterday: two piles of human sh*te, one very fresh, fresh loose loo roll, fag butts, fag packets, food wrappers stuffed into cracks. Maybe the worst I've ever seen a summit.
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Re: For the record -

Postby cruachan06 » Mon Aug 02, 2021 10:27 pm

Can't comment on the summits, so I won't. :D

What I will say as a recent convert to walking and as a runner, I'm getting really annoyed by my fellow runners thnking it's OK to leave energy gel wrappers all over the trails, especially in places like Chatelherault Country Park or Strathclyde Park where there are plenty of bins on the trails.
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Re: For the record -

Postby Sgurr » Mon Aug 02, 2021 10:37 pm

I get a rant once a week. I think it's justified: he is stuck in a nursing home with nobody else to whom to blow his top off as his nearest and dearest all think the home is wonderful. I used to be the business partner of HIS nearest and dearest, but Covid saw to that, and I am a rubbish replacement as a listener. I get about half an hour of "Cheeky sods," and "I know I am supposed to ring and someone comes, but that's just the theory, it's not life as I live it." It makes him feel better. I assume the OP has had a bad day. I hope he feels better now.
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Re: For the record -

Postby NickyRannoch » Mon Aug 02, 2021 11:40 pm

Kevin29035 wrote:In the crevasse just under the trig on the Ben More, Crianlarich, yesterday: two piles of human sh*te, one very fresh, fresh loose loo roll, fag butts, fag packets, food wrappers stuffed into cracks. Maybe the worst I've ever seen a summit.


I trust you carried it out :lol:
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Re: For the record -

Postby jupe1407 » Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:20 am

Kevin29035 wrote:In the crevasse just under the trig on the Ben More, Crianlarich, yesterday: two piles of human sh*te, one very fresh, fresh loose loo roll, fag butts, fag packets, food wrappers stuffed into cracks. Maybe the worst I've ever seen a summit.


This reminds me of Ben Alder last year in July - it was one of the first weekends without distance restrictions. We got to the summit and the first two shelters had human sh*tes in them, the third thankfully was ok. At this point I must confess to leaving one on a mountain, once - the wee grassy plateau off to the right before the quartzy stuff on Sgurr a'Bhuic. An entire weekend of walking and living off protein bars finally caught up with me and I had no choice but to lay cable out sight and well off the route. I had nothing with me to dig a hole and there was absolutely no danger i was taking it with me :lol:

Anyway, I think I can top your cairn find. Mullach Frach Coire in Kintail around 2014. Got to the cairn only to find a used tampon stuffed into it.
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Re: For the record -

Postby BlackPanther » Tue Aug 03, 2021 8:35 am

jupe1407 wrote:Anyway, I think I can top your cairn find. Mullach Frach Coire in Kintail around 2014. Got to the cairn only to find a used tampon stuffed into it.


I can match this. On the way up Ben Starav, stopped by a large rock for a breather. We found several used female towels, spread out on the grass by the rock :shock: My husband commented that the infamous Glasgow serial killer, the Bible John, must be stalking this area...
As a woman, I find this aspect particularly disgusting. Female hygiene product can be easily wrapped up and carried off the hills. But as said above, we're preaching to the converted here...
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Re: For the record -

Postby al78 » Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:41 am

Don't know why some are retailiating against the OP, he is right, at least when it comes to UK hill environments. The Scottish mountains have a sub-Arctic climate and it will take a long time for organic matter to decompose, plus the release of nutrients from the decomposition will affect the soil and soil biology, which is delicate in these environments. If I am doing a low level walk in Sussex I don't see a problem with discarding a banana skin underneath a shrub out of sight, because in that environment a banana skin will decompose and be gone within a few weeks, as confirmed when I sling banana skins on my garden.
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Re: For the record -

Postby matt_outandabout » Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:26 am

@lightfoot2017 - I do apologise for the tone, you are right it was somewhat preachy. It came after another day when I got off the hill and emptied a bag of other people's waste into my own bin.

That said, it was also intended to be somewhat fun approach to what seems to be a growing issue.

I will however stand by my comment: we should not leave such things behind.

At the end of the day it is just rubbish that detracts from our environment and taking it home to the compost heap or bin is the better thing to do.
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Re: For the record -

Postby rgf101 » Tue Aug 03, 2021 1:19 pm

> results that banana skins and nut shells can take two years or more to decompose fully and orange peel and apple cores, two months

It's not about the time it takes to decompose, though. Even if that kind of litter instantly turned into compost on hitting the ground, it's still compost that shouldn't be there.
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Re: For the record -

Postby Jon and Jen » Tue Aug 03, 2021 3:12 pm

rgf101 wrote:> results that banana skins and nut shells can take two years or more to decompose fully and orange peel and apple cores, two months

It's not about the time it takes to decompose, though. Even if that kind of litter instantly turned into compost on hitting the ground, it's still compost that shouldn't be there.

Also introducing what is, to them, exotic foods for native wildlife. A mountain hare should never see an Apple core or a banana skin. It's just not right for the ecosystem.
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Re: For the record -

Postby rockhopper » Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:02 pm

I suspect that much of the stuff we carry on to the hills is not natural to the hills environment and ecology. Accordingly, it seems to me that anything discarded may adversely affect that environment and ecology. Therefore, the logical solution to me seems to me to be to carry off anything we carry on regardless of how short or long a time it may take to degrade.
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Re: For the record -

Postby bar72 » Wed Aug 04, 2021 9:08 am

used wet wipes does my nut in. can't they just drip dry like my wife does?
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Re: For the record -

Postby gammy leg walker » Wed Aug 04, 2021 12:18 pm

Lightfoot2017 wrote:
boriselbrus wrote:You brought it with you, you take it away with you.


Nope. I'll throw it onto the hillside thanks. And, as I say, leave something nutritional and tasty for the beasties.



I suppose you’re back garden is full of apple cores and banana skins, if so must stink to the heavens
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Re: For the record -

Postby Tringa » Wed Aug 04, 2021 1:35 pm

Iain R wrote:Yep, back in simpler times we thought "biodegradable" meant just that, your banana skin or applecore would be invisible in a couple of weeks, now we know better.

However, I'll venture the unpopular (but probably widely, if quietly, held) opinion, that we are largely preaching to the converted on forums such as these; the increasing incidence of this and other flytipping in the hills and glens (abandoned cheap camping equipment, anyone?) is largely not perpetrated by the sort of people with a genuine interest in the outdoors, but rather the social media mountaineers and casual visitors who have descended on the hills because they can't go anywhere else justnow. People with no knowledge of, or interest in learning, the etiquette of the outdoors. Not saying there aren't "old hands" who chose not to care, but it's a minority compared to the alternative.

We can chunter on here all we like about how good we are at leaving no trace, but let's face it, we all recognise the true culprits, and they don't tend to be regular denizens of walking and climbing forums. Doubtless I'll be accused of "gatekeeping" or asked for statistical evidence, but let's open our eyes for a minute here...



Very true. Most of us on here don't leave litter and worse in the hills, I hope.

The folks that do are unlikely to frequent this forum(and as you say are only in the hills because they can't easily go elsewhere) and, I think, wouldn't change their behaviour if they did. I find it difficult to believe anyone who leaves litter in the hills thinks it is OK to do so. They know very well it is not acceptable but just don't care.

I don't know what the solution is and perhaps the problem will reduce when all COVID19 related restrictions are lifted and they go somewhere else, though I wouldn't wish such behaviour on any other place.

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