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Campervans

Re: Campervans

Postby SMRussell » Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:04 am

I completely understand why people get infuriated by the sheer rise in people opting to travel around the country in either motorhomes or campervans (handy guide to the difference between motorhomes, campervans etc. here - https://www.brownhills.co.uk/campervan-differences.html) and of course the inevitable irresponsible/inconsiderate behaviour and poor driving/road hogging this can bring.

To suggest that all or most folks who choose to explore Scotland (and elsewhere in the UK) this way are a problem is shortsighted and lacks nuance. I think KeithS has covered most bases re infrastructure and the role rental companies play, and as others have said other road users can be just as bad. Dangerous overtaking, inconsiderate or aggressive driving from all forms of road user is possibly a bigger issue generally, though I can understand why motorhomes cause anger when in high volume. Improved education re one-lane winding roads and that remote areas are not playgrounds but part of communities and nature and there for should be respected is vital as is improved infrastructure.

I find it pretty saddening that people are often viewing everyone who has motorhome or campervan as selfish and irresponsible idiots. We own a van that is part converted into a campervan. It is a short wheelbase low top Renault Trafic (single "f" intentional). It is actually a bit shorter than our Ford Mondeo estate to give you an idea of size. So it fits into a standard parking space and can be driven at speed. We park responsibly and always research possible places to park up for the nights we intend to stay in the van rather than accommodation, as we don't want to cause upset or park inappropriately. We very rarely see a queue of traffic forming behind us and in fact have been subjected to being stuck behind motorhomes getting increasingly irritated by them not pulling over to let the traffic flow so I do understand that. We like to use local shops, cafes, and pubs while away - though recently we have done this a little less due to Covid-19.

The NC500 situation in bonkers. I don't know why anyone would want to start encouraging high numbers folks to do this route in large vehicles without appropriate infrastructure. My former partner and I basically followed this route back in 2008/9ish I think, way before it became an official thing to do because it seemed like a beautiful road trip - which of course it was, and that was partly because it was pretty quiet. We were just in a car with a tent though and stayed at campsites and the odd budget B&B which worked for us at the time. I have little desire to repeat it these days given all the problems it has created and, due to the popularity of the route, it would likely be a frustrating experience!
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Re: Campervans

Postby SMRussell » Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:07 am

Tringa wrote: it isn't helped by comments such "In Scotland you can go wild camping, you can just make a fire and camp wherever you like" from this video -



This video is astonishingly irresponsible! :shock:
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Re: Campervans

Postby al78 » Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:23 am

Giant Stoneater wrote:I don't drive but a regular passenger,its not just campervans that are a problem other motorists create problems as well,some don't seem to comprehend what speed limits are with some crawling along at 40mph on 60mph roads etc.


Ah yes the 40 mph club, one thing that makes driving in rural areas in the SE a pain sometimes. It appears some cars come with bombs installed which will arm if the car reaches 40 mph, so the driver avoids reaching that speed.

As annoying as the teeny tiny road club, which seemed to come out in force whenever I used to cycle the 10 miles to work. Two miles on the main road, not too bad traffic-wise. Turn onto the unclassified country lanes, CONVOY CONVOY CONVOY, everyone up my backside, the kamikaze overtake into oncoming traffic. I blame satnavs routing people alone minor roads and turning them into rat runs.
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Re: Campervans

Postby al78 » Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:32 am

SMRussell wrote:I find it pretty saddening that people are often viewing everyone who has motorhome or campervan as selfish and irresponsible idiots.


It makes a change from people hating on cyclists.

I have occasionally wondered what it would be like to cycle the NC500, problem is on those roads, there often isn't a safe place to pull over and let traffic past (except on the single track roads), so I could see how me huffing and puffing up the Bealach Na-Ba road would cause some antagonism to other road users.

Ultimately, if you are going to advertise the beauty of Scotland to the world, you shouldn't be surprised if a lot of people visit, and more people than the limited infrastructure can cope with.
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Re: Campervans

Postby CharlesT » Mon Sep 21, 2020 10:59 am

Glengavel wrote:And if you're being held up by a caravan outfit, rest assured it isn't me, I nip along con brio! :D

So long as it's not largo con brio :D
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Re: Campervans

Postby Border Reiver » Mon Sep 21, 2020 4:05 pm

It would be interesting to hire a campervan (I wouldn't want to though) just to see what information is provided by the hiring company about what the hirers can and cannot do along the way, what to expect and how to help the rural economy. I'm certain that a lot of Scotland's (indeed any rural area) problems arise from bad information and advice from rental firms, tourist info companies and groups representing other groups like wild campers, motorcyclists, walkers, hikers etc. We brand some of them idiots, but they need educating before setting off, and telling folk that's just fine to light a fire anywhere you like, really isn't helpful. The Scottish tourist board could be proactive by blitzing all these groups and companies with all the correct information, and not just putting leaflets in tourist information places.
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Re: Campervans

Postby Glengavel » Mon Sep 21, 2020 6:49 pm

CharlesT wrote:
Glengavel wrote:And if you're being held up by a caravan outfit, rest assured it isn't me, I nip along con brio! :D

So long as it's not largo con brio :D


Hmm, largo - broad, slow, dignified...is that me personally or my caravan outfit? :think:
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Re: Campervans

Postby Manwaeadug » Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:02 pm

:twisted: Hey! At least we don't overnight in lay-bys, passing places and any spare level couple of square metres by the side of the road. Why campervans can get away with this and caravans can't is puzzling, but that's another matter. And if you're being held up by a caravan outfit, rest assured it isn't me, I nip along con brio! :D[/quote]

I honestly don't mind caravans. :lol:

But, tractors............... :wink:
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Re: Campervans

Postby mynthdd2 » Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:29 pm

I am ok with tractors but get me on the subject of horse boxes on wheels well then grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
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Re: Campervans

Postby EmilyD » Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:14 am

How do you expect people to move their horses?

When I've towed a horse trailer, I pull over when there's a line of traffic behind me and there's a safe layby. That thing that 99.999999% of motorhome drivers don't do.

As far as the topic of this thread goes, Highland infrastructure sucks. Ten years ago, it sucked in an idiosyncratic but entertaining way, but with the rising visitor numbers (nevermind lockdown lunacy), it just sucks. No one's invested much in it, for decades. There aren't enough carparks and public loos or public transport up Glen Nevis or Rowardennan and similar honeypots. The A82 has accidents every weekend because there are too many idiots and maniacs. And it doesn't help when a film crew working on an advert or film scene with a brand new Bentley take over half the Lost Valley carpark in Glencoe, on a busy Sunday with glorious weather, and close the road.... but I digress.... Scotland has been plugged heavily as a tourist destination. My parents live in the US, and say they often see ads touting it on TV. And the tourists have come, but no one's built an infrastructure that can cope.

I thought Paul Webster's WalkHighlands article comparing us to European Alpine regions was excellent.
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Re: Campervans

Postby Manwaeadug » Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:52 am

EmilyD wrote:How do you expect people to move their horses?
.


Sit on them and tell them to giddyup? :wink:
:)
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Re: Campervans

Postby Booga » Mon Sep 28, 2020 4:21 pm

SMRussell wrote:
Tringa wrote: it isn't helped by comments such "In Scotland you can go wild camping, you can just make a fire and camp wherever you like" from this video -



This video is astonishingly irresponsible! :shock:


Agreed! Part of the problem is journalists, writers, bloggers etc advertising what fun you can have somewhere without mentioning responsibilities or proper behaviour. I also wish the whole concept of a "camp fire" would die out, the hundreds of fire scars we see have have mostly been created unneccesarily by people who are either pretending to be Bear Grylls or think they need a fire for "atmosphere".

Then there's the "Bothies are like holiday cottages but free" articles that seemed to be common a while back. :(
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Re: Campervans

Postby Sgurr » Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:37 pm

al78 wrote:
SMRussell wrote:I find it pretty saddening that people are often viewing everyone who has motorhome or campervan as selfish and irresponsible idiots.


It

I have occasionally wondered what it would be like to cycle the NC500,.


It was lovely when I did it in 1983. I wouldn't do it now, even if I could. Then there was a ferry at Kylescu. That would soon sort them out.
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Re: Campervans

Postby mynthdd2 » Tue Aug 02, 2022 12:14 pm

Just back from the Shetland islands - bliss and not a camper van convoy in sight. Perfect for great hillwalking but oooops wait a minute ….terrible place and no one should go there at all
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Re: Campervans

Postby mproudfoot » Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:43 pm

iain_atkinson_1986 wrote:To be fair, campervans are nowhere near as big an issue as people who simply cannot drive. I was staying down in Oban for a few days and came home to Inverness this afternoon. The guy driving the Jaguar (with four exhaust pipes) at 35mph on the A82 for a good 20 miles was much more of an inconvenience than any campervan or motorhome was. Add to that the hoards of motorbikers who think that overtaking on blind summits and sharp bends isn't a bad idea just because they're going 90mph and you're in for a frustrating drive.

At the end of the day it's not really the cyclists/bikers/motorhomers etc fault. Highland infrastructure is simply dismal and needs immediate and massive investment. I'm not sure what the answer is as I don't exactly want to see a motorway laid over Rannoch Moor but at the moment that seems preferable to the status quo.

The section of A82 between Ardlui and Tarbet seems to scare a lot of drivers - seems like almost every time I am driving back South after a hill day, there's at least one car on this stretch, doing 35-40mph and braking hard at every corner.

On the subject of campervans, while I do feel like I spend far too much time sitting behind a bunch of weekend gypsies/white boxes on wheels, I do appreciate that they are a key part of Scotland's tourism. Personally, I just feel like we should have those signs that we have on single track roads "please use passing places to allow overtaking" on all roads (though we may need more lay-bys/passing places on some roads).
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