walkhighlands

This forum is for general discussion about walking and scrambling... If writing a report or sharing your experiences from a route, please use the other boards.

Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.


Postby Sunset tripper » Mon Jan 04, 2021 6:56 pm

Two hillwalkers fined for breaching travel regulations after calling out mountain rescue.They had travelled from Oban which is in Argyll and Bute into Highland which is outside their local area. No details of where they started from but Altnafeadh is more than 5 miles from Argyll and Bute by road. About 9 miles which makes it illegal I guess. Ironically Buachaille Etive Mor used to be in Argyll.
https://www-pressandjournal-co-uk.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/highlands/2785612/walkers-fined-following-glencoe-rescue-after-breaching-covid-travel-guidelines/amp/?amp_js_v=a6&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQHKAFQArABIA%3D%3D#aoh=16097820498880&csi=1&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pressandjournal.co.uk%2Ffp%2Fnews%2Fhighlands%2F2785612%2Fwalkers-fined-following-glencoe-rescue-after-breaching-covid-travel-guidelines%2F
User avatar
Sunset tripper
 
Posts: 2558
Joined: Nov 3, 2013
Location: Inverness

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby AyrshireAlps » Mon Jan 04, 2021 8:03 pm

They had to do it, no other option really.

If two folk break the current well published rules, coming from one authority into another, potentially exposing up to 25 MRT volunteers to them, and they weren't charged, what would be the point of the rules?, and what message would it send?.

No brainer.
AyrshireAlps
Stravaiging
 
Posts: 233
Joined: Nov 10, 2020

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby Tringa » Mon Jan 04, 2021 8:19 pm

Agree and also it is not as if there isn't enough space in Argyll and Bute to exercise.

I think the restrictions should be tightened. Perhaps no travel out of your own region and also no more than 5 miles from home.

It would be difficult to police for those who leave home on foot or use public transport but very easy for those travelling by car to be caught, by ANPR.

Dave
User avatar
Tringa
 
Posts: 216
Joined: Sep 2, 2008
Location: London

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby gman » Mon Jan 04, 2021 8:50 pm

The current law (up to 4th Jan) allows

(t)exercise outdoors, provided that the exercise—
(i)is not organised, and
(ii)starts and ends at the same place, which place must be—
(aa)in the local government area in which the person lives, or
(bb)within 5 miles of such local government area


https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ssi/2020/344/schedule/5

So the legal restriction is that the start/finish point must be within 5 miles of your local authority boundary. The usual Buachaille car parks look to be about 6 miles from A&B. It's possible that these guys thought they were within the limit.
User avatar
gman
 
Posts: 768
Munros:250   Corbetts:4
Sub 2000:1   
Joined: Sep 12, 2011

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby CharlesT » Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:16 pm

Whether they did or did not think they were within their limits is irrelevant. They endangered themselves and 25 MRT personnel. Utterly selfish and they deserved to be fined.
User avatar
CharlesT
Mountaineer
 
Posts: 4247
Munros:156   Corbetts:2
Hewitts:262
Wainwrights:214   Islands:2
Joined: Dec 22, 2011
Location: West Oxfordshire

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby ScotFinn65 » Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:32 pm

CharlesT wrote:hether they did or did not think they were within their limits is irrelevant. They endangered themselves and 25 MRT personnel. Utterly selfish and they deserved to be fined.


Whilst l understand your point, wouldn't 2 walkers living in Glen Coe village out the same risk to MRT?

I think it's the arbitrary nature of the geography that is annoying everybody. It would be better if the powers would just allow it or disallow it.
User avatar
ScotFinn65
Hill Bagger
 
Posts: 178
Munros:73   Corbetts:1
Sub 2000:1   
Islands:3
Joined: Oct 10, 2017
Location: Lempäälä - Finland
Walk wish-list

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby Sunset tripper » Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:40 pm

CharlesT wrote:Whether they did or did not think they were within their limits is irrelevant. They endangered themselves and 25 MRT personnel. Utterly selfish and they deserved to be fined.


That's a wee bit harsh Charles. They got fined probably £30 for breaking a travel restriction. Climbing the hills, making mistakes and calling out Mountain rescue is not a criminal offence just yet. If the same 2 boys had lived and travelled from Glencoe village or Fort William they would have no case to answer.

Yes it was certainly naive and they can't really grumble about the fine even if it is a postcode lottery it is still the law.

My reason for posting the article was to highlight what can happen. Everyone be careful and learn the travel rules and be careful if you are on the hills.

All the best. :D
User avatar
Sunset tripper
 
Posts: 2558
Joined: Nov 3, 2013
Location: Inverness

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby Border Reiver » Mon Jan 04, 2021 11:54 pm

If they hadn't needed help no-one else would have been any the wiser. But they did need help and one of them plus a MRT member needed treatment from the NHS, which in some parts of the UK right now, might have been at a hospital which was already struggling to cope with covid patients. Also, the MRT would have had to sanitise all of the equipment used as well as themselves after the rescue. It kind of makes you think twice about planning things though.
User avatar
Border Reiver
Wanderer
 
Posts: 1474
Munros:202   Corbetts:7
Grahams:3   Donalds:1
Sub 2000:2   Hewitts:61
Wainwrights:68   Islands:31
Joined: Feb 18, 2011
Location: North East England

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby jupe1407 » Tue Jan 05, 2021 9:12 am

I'm not buying that they wouldn't have been aware how far BEM was from Oban either. Almost everyone knows about the "extra 5 miles" and literally everyone i know who's contemplated walking in another borderline area has checked google maps. I suspect that group has thought "ach bugger it, it's close enough".

The fine is fully merited, though I'd prefer to see various outlets stress it is for breaking the travel restrictions alone (I've seen a couple of vaguely worded articles that might give folk the impression it's for calling out MRT).
User avatar
jupe1407
Mountain Walker
 
Posts: 1414
Munros:245   Corbetts:37
Grahams:11   
Sub 2000:5   
Islands:2
Joined: May 15, 2012
Location: Forfar

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby Scraggygoat » Tue Jan 05, 2021 9:47 am

Interesting, if they'd done Bidean or the AE from Clachaig they would have been entirely within the additional 5 mile stipulation, and ironically closer to Glencoe village. But if the party had traveled from Wick, they would have certainly being breaking the spirit but not the law.........

In my view MRT's do the casualties of the future no favours, with such press releases.
Scraggygoat
 
Posts: 153
Joined: Mar 7, 2014

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby Giant Stoneater » Tue Jan 05, 2021 9:54 am

One of the things about not travelling outside your local authority area is the size of these areas for example Highland area which stretches from Glencoe to Durness/John O'Groats is close to 200 miles,going by government restrictions i could travel anywhere along this road for excercise as am not leaving that area, if i happen to live there,i know this is taking the **** but it is still within the wording which i think is wrong.
Giant Stoneater
Scrambler
 
Posts: 713
Joined: Aug 2, 2014

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby gman » Tue Jan 05, 2021 9:58 am

jupe1407 wrote:I'm not buying that they wouldn't have been aware how far BEM was from Oban either.


The distance between the Buachaille and Oban isn't an issue, the law restricts the distance between the start/finish point of outdoor exercise and your local authority boundary. I'm sure you knew that, just for clarification. For example the guys could have driven down Glen Etive, parked there and climbed the Buachaille without breaking the law.
User avatar
gman
 
Posts: 768
Munros:250   Corbetts:4
Sub 2000:1   
Joined: Sep 12, 2011

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby iain_atkinson_1986 » Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:39 am

Giant Stoneater wrote:One of the things about not travelling outside your local authority area is the size of these areas for example Highland area which stretches from Glencoe to Durness/John O'Groats is close to 200 miles,going by government restrictions i could travel anywhere along this road for excercise as am not leaving that area, if i happen to live there,i know this is taking the **** but it is still within the wording which i think is wrong.


Why is it taking the ****? I've driven up to Assynt and down to Ardgour (from Inverness) a fair bit since the tier system came in. Cases in Highland Council area are and were comparatively low so so long as people aren't coming into or going out of and coming back to the area I don't see much of a problem.
Last edited by iain_atkinson_1986 on Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
iain_atkinson_1986
Munro compleatist
 
Posts: 319
Munros:46   Corbetts:162
Grahams:6   Donalds:7
Sub 2000:4   
Joined: Jul 27, 2016
Location: Inverness

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby al78 » Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:44 am

CharlesT wrote:Whether they did or did not think they were within their limits is irrelevant. They endangered themselves and 25 MRT personnel. Utterly selfish and they deserved to be fined.


Is anyone who goes into the hills in the absence of a pandemic and gets into difficulties needing the MRT utterly selfish?

I would say the selfishness is breaking rules to suit yourself, not the actual hillwalking/mountaineering.
User avatar
al78
Walker
 
Posts: 1042
Munros:28   Corbetts:8
Donalds:1
Joined: Feb 1, 2018

Re: Glencoe hillwalkers fined for travel violation.

Postby CharlesT » Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:05 am

al78 wrote:
CharlesT wrote:Whether they did or did not think they were within their limits is irrelevant. They endangered themselves and 25 MRT personnel. Utterly selfish and they deserved to be fined.


Is anyone who goes into the hills in the absence of a pandemic and gets into difficulties needing the MRT utterly selfish?

I would say the selfishness is breaking rules to suit yourself, not the actual hillwalking/mountaineering.

No, the selfishness is in breaking the rules/guidance as you say, and that is what I meant. If my statement can be construed otherwise I can only apologise for my lack of precision in language.
User avatar
CharlesT
Mountaineer
 
Posts: 4247
Munros:156   Corbetts:2
Hewitts:262
Wainwrights:214   Islands:2
Joined: Dec 22, 2011
Location: West Oxfordshire

Next



Walkhighlands community forum is advert free


Your generosity keeps this site running.
Can you help support Walkhighlands and the online community by donating by direct debit?



Return to General discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests