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Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby denfinella » Wed Jul 14, 2021 2:31 pm

Giant Stoneater wrote:Laybys are supposed to be used as rest stops etc not for someone to park up and go hillwalking for 6 to 12 hrs depriving other folk the use of them.


If this were the case, then many, many of Scotland's hills would be out of bounds from their usual routes.
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Moriarty » Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:52 pm

jupe1407 wrote:He's got a point tbf. Being able to own/lease, run, insure and fuel a car for X amount of money then complaining that you can't afford a fiver once in a blue moon to park it for a hillwalk is nonsense. The charges in Wales are a bit mental and obviously designed to relieve tourists of money, however I don't think charges in Scotland are that unreasonable. £2 for Glen Doll for example, and £4 the last time I was at Glen Muick are hardly exhorbitant especially since both of these have facilities which need maintenance.

Are parking charges in Scotland really that big a deal? I've done nearly 400 hills including repeats, corbetts, grahams etc and i doubt I've even paid to park more than 10 times in 9 years.


I knew a guy through a club who drove a relatively low fuel efficiency 40K car. Must have been mounting up £30-40 most weekends in fuel costs, large amount on accommodation, gear, meals/pints at weekends. He spat his dummy at having to shell out a few quid for parking. It doesn't come across well.

That said, I'm sorry to see that the Cairngorm Outdoor Access Trust is no longer running and getting the proceeds from Spittal of Glenmuick. Happy to see proceeds going to path repair. Not so happy funding fantastically rich landowners like the Windsors. Does anyone know if the proceeds are being funnelled to anything in particular?
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Glengavel » Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:55 pm

Giant Stoneater wrote:
al78 wrote:
Giant Stoneater wrote:They charge that because people except it and dont rebel against it, Lochnagar is no different big car park, easiest route, just watch and see what happens over the next few years.

I took the bus from Llanberis, i think all cars get ticketed along that road now.


Surely not here, which looks like a legitimate layby for parking and is where I parked.

https://goo.gl/maps/ZjQzVaPj8Gs9hNi7A


Laybys are supposed to be used as rest stops etc not for someone to park up and go hillwalking for 6 to 12 hrs depriving other folk the use of them.


Is that an 'official' lay-by? There's no big blue 'P' for example. The OS map shows it as a parking area.
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby rabthecairnterrier » Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:14 pm

Giant Stoneater wrote:
al78 wrote:
Giant Stoneater wrote:They charge that because people except it and dont rebel against it, Lochnagar is no different big car park, easiest route, just watch and see what happens over the next few years.

I took the bus from Llanberis, i think all cars get ticketed along that road now.


Surely not here, which looks like a legitimate layby for parking and is where I parked.

https://goo.gl/maps/ZjQzVaPj8Gs9hNi7A


Laybys are supposed to be used as rest stops etc not for someone to park up and go hillwalking for 6 to 12 hrs depriving other folk the use of them.


Unless there is a specific byelaw/traffic management order in place prohibiting it, there is no time limit on how long a vehicle can be left in a layby any more than there is with parking on a residential urban street.
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Sunset tripper » Thu Jul 15, 2021 1:08 pm

jupe1407 wrote:He's got a point tbf. Being able to own/lease, run, insure and fuel a car for X amount of money then complaining that you can't afford a fiver once in a blue moon to park it for a hillwalk is nonsense. The charges in Wales are a bit mental and obviously designed to relieve tourists of money, however I don't think charges in Scotland are that unreasonable. £2 for Glen Doll for example, and £4 the last time I was at Glen Muick are hardly exhorbitant especially since both of these have facilities which need maintenance.

Are parking charges in Scotland really that big a deal? I've done nearly 400 hills including repeats, corbetts, grahams etc and i doubt I've even paid to park more than 10 times in 9 years.


That's a fair point Jupe and if it stayed like that it wouldn't be much of an issue. Arrochar car parks have started charging £9 for parking in the last couple of years. Are you happy for Glen Doll to do the same or what about £10 or even more?

The lakes down south are charging a fortune for parking, blatant profiteering which is not the way it is in the highlands. They had to bin the parking company that made £1000s out of issuing tickets. What's to stop Ben Nevis charging £40 a day like someone mentioned they do at Snowdon.
The NF car park is free at the moment. They could easily charge £10. Mountaineering Scotland have been very naive about this saying their members are happy to pay £3 or £4 a day which gives the green light for all car parks to charge. Argyll and Bute I'm sure were pleased to hear MS willing to pay £4 for parking but increased it from £1 to £9 anyway. :shock:

Keep the highlands free of these extortionate charges and don't encourage them! :D
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Sunset tripper » Thu Jul 15, 2021 1:27 pm

Moriarty wrote:
I knew a guy through a club who drove a relatively low fuel efficiency 40K car. Must have been mounting up £30-40 most weekends in fuel costs, large amount on accommodation, gear, meals/pints at weekends. He spat his dummy at having to shell out a few quid for parking. It doesn't come across well.


That's a great wee anecdote but not much of an argument for implementing or increasing parking charges across the highlands if that's what it is. Or Is it in some cryptic way supposed to suggest there is something wrong with not wanting the parking charges of the south spreading north to the highlands? :roll:

If you drive round the lake district stopping in the parking areas next to the lakes for a wonder about it will cost you a small fortune. If you drive round Loch Ness right now you will find every single parking area at the lochside to be free.

It's worth thinking about why it is like that. :wink:

It's not all about hillwalkers :wink:
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Moriarty » Thu Jul 15, 2021 5:05 pm

Sunset tripper wrote:That's a great wee anecdote but not much of an argument for implementing or increasing parking charges across the highlands if that's what it is. Or Is it in some cryptic way supposed to suggest there is something wrong with not wanting the parking charges of the south spreading north to the highlands? :roll:

If you drive round the lake district stopping in the parking areas next to the lakes for a wonder about it will cost you a small fortune. If you drive round Loch Ness right now you will find every single parking area at the lochside to be free.

It's worth thinking about why it is like that. :wink:

It's not all about hillwalkers :wink:


Gosh. Recognises anecdote....constructs Strawman argument to misattribute to anecdote.....masterfully defeats Strawman argument with sanctimonious ire....pause for triumphant winkies.

All your hallmarks bud. :roll:

I truly hope that all this righteous anger about the subject translates into some real world action on your part. It would be a shame if it was all keyboard warfare, social media hot air and emoticons.
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby tigerburnie » Thu Jul 15, 2021 5:19 pm

As well as hill walking I also go fishing, including a few treats after a Salmon or a Sea Trout, now I could pay a £1000 for a day if I was feeling flush, I'm not but do on occasion pay close to a £100, now work that out at an hourly rate, what the hell can you do that you enjoy that costs less than a couple £1 an hour and won't get you arrested?
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Sunset tripper » Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:15 pm

Moriarty wrote:
Gosh. Recognises anecdote....constructs Strawman argument to misattribute to anecdote.....masterfully defeats Strawman argument with sanctimonious ire....pause for triumphant winkies.

All your hallmarks bud. :roll:

I truly hope that all this righteous anger about the subject translates into some real world action on your part. It would be a shame if it was all keyboard warfare, social media hot air and emoticons.


I'm still not sure what your viewpoint is or the point of your wee anecdote but never mind.

I will try to be clear about my view - I don't wish for extortionate parking charges throughout the highlands. I also don't see the relevance of what other things people spend their money on, whether it's 40k cars or £1000s on gear and beer. The car park charging tactics in Snowdonia and the lakes dont belong in the highlands and I'm quite happy to pay for it, and improved affordable for all public transport, through my taxes if required even though it would probably cost me more.

Now the winkies. That was just for you because you use them so often. Now that I am informed they are triumphant winkies I will refrain from using them further.




Ps - sensational banter Moriarty - keep it up. :D :D :D
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Moriarty » Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:35 pm

Sunset tripper wrote:Now the winkies. That was just for you because you use them so often. Now that I am informed they are triumphant winkies I will refrain from using them further.


Lovely. I'd be fascinated to see the data. It's pretty much normal social media behaviour to accuse others of your own personal sins/habits.....but I'd be fascinated to see the audit data on the subject (well, for a given value of fascinated).

Perhaps you could start with an audit of your last 200 posts and whether they contain a winkie and work from there. ;)

Still, I'm blushing that you say you use them just for me, I know you perk up the minute I join a conversation, but it still gives me a tingle that I mean so much. :lol:

Anyway, we shouldn't take up time and space on this forum with our personal bickering....the denizens will object. Try to focus on not personalising things and chase the ball, not the man.
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby davekeiller » Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:14 pm

@Jon and Jen Parking tickets are theoretically enforceable, although in reality it's generally too much hassle and they won't bother.

One of my objections to the introduction of parking charges is that it's generally unclear why they've been introduced. It would be fair enough if the money was going towards the upkeep of the car park, or to facilities like toilets and paths, but often it feels like they've been introduced to profiteer.
In towns and cities, it's often a way to persuade people to park elsewhere or use public transport. Trouble is that it causes as many problems as it solves.
There's also the issue of needing change. Cash is discouraged in shops, and I personally rarely carry it any more. If you suddenly need coins for parking they're not always immediately available!
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Scottk » Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:42 pm

The Glen Muick parking fees go towards path maintenance but I must admit that I was rather that Balmoral had left it with the outdoor trust. The toilets there are run by the council so presumably no cost to the estate.
The estate has always been proactive with access and path upkeep but obviously the volume of people in recent years has grown exponentially.
I can remember when it was free and then it was a voluntary contribution towards the upkeep and now £5 with an attendant! I won’t grudge paying it but certainly won’t be getting an annual pass anymore. It also states that the parking charges are every day or part day, seven days a week. Wonder what happens when you go out for a few days?
The shop at the ranger station is doing hot drinks now which I haven’t noticed before.
The road will be closed if the car park is full and apparently Balmoral are using social media to alert people. Not a problem if you are there early but have seen the road closed twice for a few hours this year.
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby gaffr » Thu Jul 15, 2021 9:24 pm

If there were wash and toilet facilities provided along with the parking charge then maybe just reasonable to pay a couple of pounds. More than that amount I would just try to avoid the charge.
I have in recent times strapped the bike onto the car and parked up away from the charged area.
Pensioner with a very small pension and having been robbed by banks and other agencies all of my days and now at nearly eighty and since last year having to pay for BBC reception and to receive a few other bits and pieces of mainly uninteresting channels that I have to bite the bullet and pay otherwise I would have no reception for TV. The payment for other channels is beyond my means.
Also recently I have been using my off-road bike for exercise which for access to my nearby hills and glens comes without any charges.
Freedom to roam, at a distance from home, is now becoming available to possibly just those with reasonable salaries?
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Sunset tripper » Thu Jul 15, 2021 9:55 pm

Moriarty wrote:It's pretty much normal social media behaviour to accuse others of your own personal sins/habits.....

...........Try to focus on not personalising things and chase the ball, not the man.



So it is - well played! :wave:
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Re: Spitball of Glen Muick parking

Postby Sunset tripper » Thu Jul 15, 2021 10:01 pm

gaffr wrote:If there were wash and toilet facilities provided along with the parking charge then maybe just reasonable to pay a couple of pounds. More than that amount I would just try to avoid the charge.
I have in recent times strapped the bike onto the car and parked up away from the charged area.
Pensioner with a very small pension and having been robbed by banks and other agencies all of my days and now at nearly eighty and since last year having to pay for BBC reception and to receive a few other bits and pieces of mainly uninteresting channels that I have to bite the bullet and pay otherwise I would have no reception for TV. The payment for other channels is beyond my means.
Also recently I have been using my off-road bike for exercise which for access to my nearby hills and glens comes without any charges.
Freedom to roam, at a distance from home, is now becoming available to possibly just those with reasonable salaries?


gaffr - I couldn't agree more.
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