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Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Winter Traverse Cairngorms


Postby The_Real_SF » Thu Aug 16, 2018 1:02 pm

Hi all, first post, be gentle ;-)

I am putting together my first multi-day winter expedition and am looking for some advice.

During Dec 2018 to February 2019 I am planning a solo traverse of the Cairngorms in Scotland, camping wild or using bothies if the conditions deteriorate too far. The route will either be from Clova to Aviemore or the reverse, Aviemore to Clova and capturing between 9-14 Munro's en route.

I am looking for some advice or guiding thoughts for those more experienced in the region in winter.

Plan in General


    The route will be two main legs split by a re-supply in Braemar (the half way point)
    Northern leg will definitely include a summit of Macdui and a descent into the Linn of Dee
    Southern leg route is undecided
    I am ex-military and confident map reader in all conditions
    I have completed multi-day hikes before but always using mountain huts and with good re-supply
    I am not planning any ice-climbs or route-finding through dangerous gullies
    I plan to break mid-way in Braemar to re-supply and let Mountain Rescue and family know I am safe before the second leg of the journey
    I will be using 4 season equipment and carrying an ice axe and crampons
    I will be taking some photography equipment including an SLR and a spare batteries
    Depending on the journey I may do the return journey as well
    This will be a step up in terms of ability, self-sufficiency and comfort zone

Questions

Any thoughts or comments appreciated, specifically;

    Any avalanche black spots
    Any spots unsuitable for a tent due to known high winds
    Additional safety advice
    Suggested Munro route
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby davekeiller » Thu Aug 16, 2018 7:40 pm

If you don't know where the likely avalanche danger areas are, do you have the necessary skills and experience for this trip?
How much experience of Scottish Winter do you have?
Have you done the route in Summer?
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby prog99 » Thu Aug 16, 2018 7:49 pm

You may spot a pattern? - https://www.sais.gov.uk/avalanche_map/?area=2&type=All Or you may not?

But it all depends on the preceding weather and the fact that the more popular areas for climbing and skiing are going to have more reports.

Two months seems awfully long?

Snowshoes?
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby Border Reiver » Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:27 pm

I know that your planned route will probably take a week or less in summer, but these are the Cairngorms and extreme weather can and does hit them without a lot of warning. If your only point of contact with civilisation is Braemar, you will be on your own between there and Aviemore and between there and Clova. If the weather did deteriorate and you got into trouble, how would anyone know where you were? Mobile phone coverage is not great and would probably be worse in snow. The weather could be anything from relatively mild, to cold and settled with temps down as low as -25c, to a full blown Cairngorms blizzard with winds up to 170mph, where there would be no safe place to pitch a tent. There are bothies and refuges but they might be either buried under snow or impossible to locate in a blizzard.
Just a suggestion...buy or borrow and read "The Black Cloud" by I.D.S.Thomson. It will give you a good idea of what could happen.
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby Cairngormwanderer » Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:30 pm

Don't like to be harsh, but you put an apostrophe in Munros. You're clearly not fit to climb them. :wink:
Seriously though, I'm assuming from the tone of your post that you have little or no winter experience? If that's the case maybe a less ambitious - or at least shorter in duration - project might be a better way to get into the swing of things.
This might have some useful advice - https://www.mountaineering.scot/activities/mountaineering/winter-mountaineering - although there's nothing about camping in winter, which can be a lot more than just summer camping but colder.
In general, though, camp low: wind strength mainly increases with height and up on the tops can shred a tent while you lie in it. Probably a good idea to camp beside or close to bothies too, as a fall-back until you're confident in your own ability to judge sites.
As for avalanches, rather than thinking about particular locations, think about types of terrain and of the pattern of snowfall and windblown snow transfer in the days or even weeks before. There's a section on avalanche awareness here - https://www.mountaineering.scot/safety-and-skills/essential-skills/weather-conditions/avalanches - and links to the avalanche forecast service and mountain weather forecasts here - https://www.mountaineering.scot/safety-and-skills/weather-and-avalanche-forecasts
Weather can be very variable over the course of a winter, from no snow to deep drifts which make movement extremely laborious, so you should set out on this prepared to change your plan from a long distance trek to walking from a base so that you're not carrying a massive rucksack all the time, and it would be a good idea to start not by heading into the wilderness but by setting up camp (or in a bothy) and taking several day walks to feel your way a bit and gauge the level of the challenge you'll be facing. You should also use this period (if you haven't attended to this already) by learning how to walk in crampons and how to ice axe brake - neither is as natural as you think.
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby spiderwebb » Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:10 pm

After just typing all my thoughts, something went wrong and its gone :lol: :lol: :lol: So second try.

Some has been said but here goes.

1. Already mentioned but weather and notably wind. Proposed camping spots may need to be changed depending on the conditions, as 4 season or not, a tent will not withstand winds that are ripping lumps off trees and roofs from houses, they are all just canvas. Whilst you will be able to gain the latest reports on weather and snow conditions, you probably won't once you're out in the wilds, so be prepared to change, have emergency routes/ideas to hand and take account of these regarding letting others know to avoid a call out unnecessarily.

2. As above re snow conditions, but also allow much more time for walking in soft deep snow, as opposed to hard stuff, although walking in crampons can be arduous depending on how use to it you are. Ability to brake with an ice axe is essential. Further to the snow conditions and the fact you won't be able to access updated information, it is worth understanding how to assess the snow while you are out, the knowledge to dig a snow pit to assess it may be useful. I've used it on several occasions, the results of which caused me to turn back, one certainly being the right decision given the amount of avalanche activity witness walking out, which was not there on the way in.

3. Not mentioned GPS, but it would be useful for plotting key points on your route, as not least it can be much easier to follow than map/compass if conditions turn bad, also useful for plotting locations of Bothies and/or shelters. Carry a spare compass.

4. Carry a bivvy bag, even the plastic ones that you can fully immerse in, as this could be a life saver in serious windchill. Also look into the techniques for a snow shelter such as a snow coffin, again to remove yourself from the windchill. A snow hole would take too much time, that could be better spent on removing yourself to lower ground.

5. I'm assuming you will be self sufficient for meals, hot meals, as the only thing keeping you warm in a sleeping bag is you. Worth carrying a flask of hot drink too.

6. For fear of stating the obvious, and asuming you will have the relevant clothing, winter mittens, windproof will be essential, and also snow goggles, balaclava, insulated layers etc.


If anything else springs to mind I'll add it in, but otherwise only you know your capabilities/experience, most of all enjoy it safely :D
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby kmai1961 » Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:54 am

Cairngormwanderer wrote:Don't like to be harsh, but you put an apostrophe in Munros. You're clearly not fit to climb them. :wink:



don't want to hijack this post, but canna resist saying:

:lol: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby The_Real_SF » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:47 am

prog99 wrote:You may spot a pattern?

But it all depends on the preceding weather and the fact that the more popular areas for climbing and skiing are going to have more reports.

Two months seems awfully long?

Snowshoes?


That is a really good resource. Thank you. I can overlay this with some routes. The two months will narrow down to a window the closer we get.
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby The_Real_SF » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:48 am

spiderwebb wrote:After just typing all my thoughts, something went wrong and its gone :lol: :lol: :lol: So second try.

Some has been said but here goes.

1. Already mentioned but weather and notably wind. Proposed camping spots may need to be changed depending on the conditions, as 4 season or not, a tent will not withstand winds that are ripping lumps off trees and roofs from houses, they are all just canvas. Whilst you will be able to gain the latest reports on weather and snow conditions, you probably won't once you're out in the wilds, so be prepared to change, have emergency routes/ideas to hand and take account of these regarding letting others know to avoid a call out unnecessarily.

2. As above re snow conditions, but also allow much more time for walking in soft deep snow, as opposed to hard stuff, although walking in crampons can be arduous depending on how use to it you are. Ability to brake with an ice axe is essential. Further to the snow conditions and the fact you won't be able to access updated information, it is worth understanding how to assess the snow while you are out, the knowledge to dig a snow pit to assess it may be useful. I've used it on several occasions, the results of which caused me to turn back, one certainly being the right decision given the amount of avalanche activity witness walking out, which was not there on the way in.

3. Not mentioned GPS, but it would be useful for plotting key points on your route, as not least it can be much easier to follow than map/compass if conditions turn bad, also useful for plotting locations of Bothies and/or shelters. Carry a spare compass.

4. Carry a bivvy bag, even the plastic ones that you can fully immerse in, as this could be a life saver in serious windchill. Also look into the techniques for a snow shelter such as a snow coffin, again to remove yourself from the windchill. A snow hole would take too much time, that could be better spent on removing yourself to lower ground.

5. I'm assuming you will be self sufficient for meals, hot meals, as the only thing keeping you warm in a sleeping bag is you. Worth carrying a flask of hot drink too.

6. For fear of stating the obvious, and asuming you will have the relevant clothing, winter mittens, windproof will be essential, and also snow goggles, balaclava, insulated layers etc.


If anything else springs to mind I'll add it in, but otherwise only you know your capabilities/experience, most of all enjoy it safely :D


Really good insight. Thank you.
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby jmarkb » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:20 am

The_Real_SF wrote:This will be a step up in terms of ability, self-sufficiency and comfort zone


If this will be your first winter backpacking trip, then you have chosen a pretty tough and serious objective. I would definitely recommend doing some shorter trips, maybe starting with a single night out somewhere not too far from safety, and building up a bit of experience before deciding to tackle the "big one".

December is likely to have less lying snow than February, but also very short daylight hours.

The problem with the Cairngorm plateaux is that you can easily get yourself into a situation where the wind and/or poor visibility makes it impossible to descend safely into a sheltered location. Take a look at the video in this post to see what fairly normal winter weather can do to a good quality tent pitched in an exposed position: https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48490
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby The_Real_SF » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:51 am

jmarkb wrote:
The_Real_SF wrote:This will be a step up in terms of ability, self-sufficiency and comfort zone


If this will be your first winter backpacking trip, then you have chosen a pretty tough and serious objective. I would definitely recommend doing some shorter trips, maybe starting with a single night out somewhere not too far from safety, and building up a bit of experience before deciding to tackle the "big one".

December is likely to have less lying snow than February, but also very short daylight hours.

The problem with the Cairngorm plateaux is that you can easily get yourself into a situation where the wind and/or poor visibility makes it impossible to descend safely into a sheltered location. Take a look at the video in this post to see what fairly normal winter weather can do to a good quality tent pitched in an exposed position: https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48490


What a fantastic and informative write up. You have given me a few things to think about.
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby davekeiller » Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:06 pm

I'm a bit concerned by the fact you say you're definitely going to ascend Ben Macdui and descend via Linn of Dee, as conditions simply might not be suitable.
It feels like you don't have much experience of Scottish Winter, and this feels a bit too ambitious unless you *really* know what you're doing.
I think you'd be best off basing yourself in Aviemore or Braemar for a week and doing day walks to build up experience in Scottish Winter conditions before embarking on a trip like this. Perhaps do a week's winter skills course at Glenmore Lodge (or Plas Y Brenin or similar) this winter, and do your big trip next winter?
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby walkingpoles » Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:00 pm

I didn't expect people who are ready to do a winter traverse of the Cairngorms to ask for advise here. I see some caveats, but only you know whether you are up to it. It's not an unsupported crossing of Greenland, but most folks here wouldn't do it. For good reasons. If the weather is benign, it's still a big effort, especially with the long nights. If the gods are against you, I hope you're not too far outside your comfort zone.

In foul weather, climbing Macdui from the skicentre is the easier thing than descending it on the other side. I can only advise you to have some back up plans. Civilisation is far (possibly more than a day hike), if things go wrong and the snow is deep.
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby walkingpoles » Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:27 pm

As to your questions:
Any avalanche black spots
Potentially anything steeper than 30 degres. Which you will encounter a lot when munroing. Be prepared.

Any spots unsuitable for a tent due to known high winds
Certainly no camps on the plateaus. I experienced atrocious wind this summer.

Additional safety advice
Be ready to back out and stay low. You aware of the river crossings?

Suggested Munro route
Planning is fun. There are also lots if walk reports to help you with it. And I don't want to be responsable for a tragedy, so I won't suggest anything.
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Re: Winter Traverse Cairngorms

Postby Caberfeidh » Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:51 am

I would advise waiting until February, as the daylight hours are much less in December and January. Weather too is likely to be gales and rain in December and January rather than good frost and snow in February (though please don't blame me if the reverse is true!). The Lairig Ghru is terrible for brutal wind conditions even when the weather is good on either side of the narrow part of the pass. Trekking and camping around the area now, before going in winter, is good for familiarising yourself with the area. The route from Lairig ghru over the shoulder of Cairn a Mhaim and passing Derry Lodge is far preferable to the route following the River Dee past the White Bridge, due to exposure to the elements on the long, wide, flat plain which is by the river and White Bridge. Bothies and shelter are available at Corrour in the open, east side of the Lairig Ghru, Bob Scott's (downstream from Derry Lodge, follow the river to it rather than the landrover track), Glen Feshie (Ruadh Aithechen bothy), The Shelter Stone at Loch A'an (spelled Avon on maps), Fords of A'an Bothy (really just a rough shelter, not somewhere cosy), Ryvoan Bothy near Glen More Lodge, and the remote and rough An Garbh Corrie shelter which is again just a shelter to get in out of the wind, not somewhere to aim for to spend the night. Any passes and areas beneath steep slopes/cliffs are subject to avalanche and stonefall. Enjoy!

010 (2)hdrR.jpg
Cairngorms winter - mild conditions


012dR.jpg
Loch Etchachan in May, very nice conditions. There was a huge avalanche of ice which smashed the ice of the loch.


013ar.jpg
Gully beside Glen Derry. Near vertical conditions


Lairigh Ghru #1r.jpg
Sunrise from Lairig Ghru


016aR.jpg
Blizzard victim, Bob Scott's in background clump of trees.


Stag Nations hdr cropped#R.jpg
Stags from Bob Scott's


Bob Scotts Icicles#R.jpg
Icicles on Bob Scott's bothy


001aR.jpg
Shelter Stone, Loch A'an


Autumnal pics 010.jpg
Ryvoan


Scotties Katabatic blast#2R.jpg
Katabatic wind blasting the frozen ground outside Bob Scott's bothy
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