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Stay at home

Re: Stay at home

Postby gammy leg walker » Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:04 am

alanlees wrote:For goodness sake stay at home - don't go into rural communities don#t go to the Highlands and take this site down!



The OP started well with the first two opening quotes,after that..............
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Re: Stay at home

Postby johnkaysleftleg » Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:20 am

rabthecairnterrier wrote:Living in the Highlands I'd have trouble staying away.
With something like 500 square miles of empty land (quite literally) on the doorstep I won't be putting anyone else at risk by not confining myself indoors.


As you're allowed a bout of outdoor exercise a day, preferably away from others you have an enviable situation. No way I would confine myself to home either.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby madprof » Wed Mar 25, 2020 10:29 am

rabthecairnterrier wrote:Let's see now - Mountain Leader, thirty years experience of applying formal risk assessment procedures to outdoor activities, strolling up an obscure 1700ft featureless heathery lump he can see from his armchair- no crags, steep slopes or other objective dangers - that he's climbed maybe a couple of hundred times before. Compare with with staying home and falling off a stepladder when painting the ceiling instead, or having an RTA when driving to Tain or Dingwall or Inverness for some essential shopping. (No MRT but I'm sure the paramedics would have better things to do.)
Objective risk assessment? Realistic chances of needing to be rescued?


Yeah you're a goner :lol:

I will avenge you, do not worry.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby hooter2014 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 11:07 am

rabthecairnterrier wrote:
hooter2014 wrote:
rabthecairnterrier wrote:Living in the Highlands I'd have trouble staying away.
With something like 500 square miles of empty land (quite literally) on the doorstep I won't be putting anyone else at risk by not confining myself indoors.


Maybe not, unless you injure yourself to the point of needing rescue, requiring others to do it.

The hills will be there in a few weeks.

#StayHomeNow


Let's see now - Mountain Leader, thirty years experience of applying formal risk assessment procedures to outdoor activities, strolling up an obscure 1700ft featureless heathery lump he can see from his armchair- no crags, steep slopes or other objective dangers - that he's climbed maybe a couple of hundred times before. Compare with with staying home and falling off a stepladder when painting the ceiling instead, or having an RTA when driving to Tain or Dingwall or Inverness for some essential shopping. (No MRT but I'm sure the paramedics would have better things to do.)
Objective risk assessment? Realistic chances of needing to be rescued?


I'm not going to get into a slanging match with you over this rab, I think the site is better than that. I would agree that there may be little chance of needing rescue with all of your experience or having an RTC (although I know the area well, my mother is from the Black Isle so the chance of an RTC may be greater). The point is this: if there is any chance at all, that staying inside for a while may help stop the spread, then we should take it. I'm assuming that you and your household have been tested and know for sure that you haven't got it, or indeed any virus that may be passed onto someone, lowering their own immunity.

There are thousands of front line NHS workers, spending long shifts with (depending on who you believe) questionable PPE and clealry at present not enough equipment, all they ask in return is that we stay at home. I for one don't thinks that is too much to ask.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby gman » Wed Mar 25, 2020 11:59 am

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imperial-college/medicine/sph/ide/gida-fellowships/Imperial-College-COVID19-NPI-modelling-16-03-2020.pdf

If you read that and understand the implications of your actions you can make an informed choice. If you're looking for answers on online forums then it's probably best to follow govt guidelines.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby mash tun » Wed Mar 25, 2020 1:13 pm

No wish to cast aspersions or anything like that but....

...it just seems to me from looking at various online sites and on the TV that some people seem to be spending their time trying to find ways of getting round the rules and justifying what they want to do.

Instead why do people not just start by staying at home and only go out if absolutely necessary ?

If we all tried to find ways round it, we'd end up with a position whereby we're more likely to spread the virus and/or something happens to us which will further stretch the NHS. Even stricter lockdown could then be enforced.

Maybe I'm looking at it in a straightforward way but when I see frontline NHS staff on the TV telling me stay at home, I take that to mean that I should focus on how to stay at home as much as is possible...........not........how can I justify getting out as much as is possible.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby hooter2014 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 1:31 pm

mash tun wrote:No wish to cast aspersions or anything like that but....

...it just seems to me from looking at various online sites and on the TV that some people seem to be spending their time trying to find ways of getting round the rules and justifying what they want to do.

Instead why do people not just start by staying at home and only go out if absolutely necessary ?

If we all tried to find ways round it, we'd end up with a position whereby we're more likely to spread the virus and/or something happens to us which will further stretch the NHS. Even stricter lockdown could then be enforced.

Maybe I'm looking at it in a straightforward way but when I see frontline NHS staff on the TV telling me stay at home, I take that to mean that I should focus on how to stay at home as much as is possible...........not........how can I justify getting out as much as is possible.


AS ABOVE :clap:

The hills, forests, beaches, paths etc will be there in a few weeks.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby Sgurr » Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:40 pm

Press the button under "Stay at Home" (What does this mean) above.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby al78 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:00 pm

mash tun wrote:No wish to cast aspersions or anything like that but....

...it just seems to me from looking at various online sites and on the TV that some people seem to be spending their time trying to find ways of getting round the rules and justifying what they want to do.

Instead why do people not just start by staying at home and only go out if absolutely necessary ?

If we all tried to find ways round it, we'd end up with a position whereby we're more likely to spread the virus and/or something happens to us which will further stretch the NHS. Even stricter lockdown could then be enforced.

Maybe I'm looking at it in a straightforward way but when I see frontline NHS staff on the TV telling me stay at home, I take that to mean that I should focus on how to stay at home as much as is possible...........not........how can I justify getting out as much as is possible.


I can't blame people to be honest. This country's p*ss-take weather has resulted in the wettest February on record with disastrous flooding in places, then as soon as the weather flips into a dry and sunny period, and the day length exceeds the night length, we are all put into lockdown thanks to the worst pandemic this century, and told not to leave our homes. Does it really need any explanation of why people might get a bit stir-crazy and look for excuses to go outside? You just watch, we'll have largely defeated this in June, restrictions are eased, then we'll experience a six month rain fest.

I will be staying at home, apart from occasional visits to my allotment to cultivate, which I can do without coming into contact with anyone, and is allowed under the demands of the authorities. Growing my own food will have the side effect of less need to visit supermarkets where spreading the virus around is much more likely.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby rabthecairnterrier » Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:29 pm

Maybe not, unless you injure yourself to the point of needing rescue, requiring others to do it.

The hills will be there in a few weeks.


#StayHomeNow[/quote]

I
'm not going to get into a slanging match with you over this rab, I think the site is better than that. I would agree that there may be little chance of needing rescue with all of your experience or having an RTC (although I know the area well, my mother is from the Black Isle so the chance of an RTC may be greater). The point is this: if there is any chance at all, that staying inside for a while may help stop the spread, then we should take it. I'm assuming that you and your household have been tested and know for sure that you haven't got it, or indeed any virus that may be passed onto someone, lowering their own immunity.


I'm not interested in slanging matches either; I am, however, interested in rational debate (emphasis on the rational).
Now, I don't know how things are where you live, but I'm in a very quiet (i.e. dead end singletrack road, handful of inhabited houses, not on the way to anywhere else) Highland glen. No-one is as yet under house arrest, and indeed the official advice is that getting out for exercise is beneficial, keeping it local, which is exactly what I'm doing. In my case that involves louping over the garden dyke, walking 300m over a field into the forest, and then around another 800m or so out on to a heather moor before strolling up the aforementioned heathery lump. I don't even set foot on a public road. As I said previously, I've made the same trip at least 200 times in the 25+ years I've been living here, in every imaginable weather condition, day and night. At no point am I any more than 3 miles from my front door. The chances of requiring rescue are minimal. A friend who lives in very similar circumstances south of Inverness and who is a senior (i.e. committee member) of his local MRT and who makes a daily ascent of his local - slightly smaller - heathery lump with his dogs has no problem with that either.
As to the possibility of passing on coronavirus to anyone else, it is an occasion of some rarity to see let alone be in contact with anyone else in the process. In the unlikely event that I did, there isn't much of a problem with maintaining a 2m separation when you can see someone coming from a mile away. Have I been tested? No - but that would involve traveling some distance and being in unnecessary contact with several other people. I have no symptoms, and Mrs Rab insists both of us test our temperature very day with a medical thermometer from the household medicine cabinet (first time it's been used in years - the thermometer that is).
As I said, I have thirty years experience of assessing risk as an ML taking young people into the outdoors. I have assessed the risk - to myself and the community at large - as minimal.
You are, of course, entitled to your own opinion.
PS I noted this when browsing the news sites earlier today: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/03/25/parts-scotland-could-have-fewer-coronavirus-restrictions-england/
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Re: Stay at home

Postby hooter2014 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 7:18 pm

rab, I wish I lived in a place like you do. Memories of many summers spent in the north of Scotland around Muir of Ord and Shieldaig in particular when I was younger I'll never forget.

I live around 80 minutes from the Lakes in Gateshead, so more often than not get my fix there. Last week I was planning to do so this week at some point, possibly even today looking at the long range forecast ( its been glorious weather today here) but half way through last week and into the weekend I decided I just could not justify it. Yes granted different to your situation, but I've driven over there 50-60 times without incident. I would happily (normally) DRA the journey, conclude its very low risk and take it as I have and I'd even been planning a low level walk, which I'd only done in misty conditions

I work along side the NHS, I see on a daily basis the strain they are in without this, so I know what impact this is having on them.

Having got in from a 11hr night shift on Monday morning I haven't crossed the door since. We can read all the articles, social media posts and news reports we want and much like statistics can usually make them suit what we want, but if I can help in any way shape or form by staying home, that is what I'm going to do.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

Stay safe whatever you and Mrs rab do.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby madprof » Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:19 pm

I live around 80 minutes from the Lakes in Gateshead, so more often than not get my fix there. Last week I was planning to do so this week at some point, possibly even today looking at the long range forecast ( its been glorious weather today here) but half way through last week and into the weekend I decided I just could not justify it. Yes granted different to your situation...


Totally different. What you are suggesting is explicitly discouraged. You could incur a fine for that. What rab is doing is explicitly encouraged.

I go for a bike ride because it is flat as a pancake here. But if I lived next to a grassy hill I could wander safely up without meeting anyone then I would. No social contact, good daily exercise, no spreading of the virus.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby hooter2014 » Thu Mar 26, 2020 12:04 am

madprof, I'm not denying it is different, clearly it is very different. I'd been considering it last week until I saw a post by Cumbria Police, several days before the "lockdown" begun and realised what a simple trip west actually meant.

Again you say explicitly encouraged. Well that depends on who you take your advice from or even how you interpret that advice. Looking at the governments advice they say, "stay at home no unnecessary journeys or social contact" then the next bit says, "only leave home for essential shopping, medical needs and exercise once a day" 2 different pieces of advice which you can as I suggested in my previous post read how you want. I would say its rather confusing.

I'm choosing to stay at home, despite the fact that I'd sooner be out and about as that is what the people at the front line are asking for.

I hope you and yours stay safe madprof.
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Re: Stay at home

Postby madprof » Thu Mar 26, 2020 9:30 am

hooter2014 wrote:I'm choosing to stay at home, despite the fact that I'd sooner be out and about as that is what the people at the front line are asking for.

I hope you and yours stay safe madprof.


Thank you I am really worried about my dad but I ought to be fine personally.

I also have good news for you. When Boris first came on the television to announce lockdown he explicitly said we could leave the house once a day to get exercise. He said exercise was good. So please leave your house to get exercise, while maintaining social distancing.

To tie this in with your message problem, daily exercise is not a journey and it is meant to be done alone so there is no social contact. So it is fine. Complete consistency.

Rab should be applauded for getting out and safely exercising without any social contact. I am sat green with envy in the flat fens but I still say bravo :clap:
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Re: Stay at home

Postby Sgurr » Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:26 am

My sister in law's partner who lives in Preston drove to a quieter place to walk (she didn't say where). and was stopped by the police and told he would be fined if he did it again. He was also told he can't go fishing. There was only one other walker visible.
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