Equipment for the WHW (in hostels and B&B) ?

[ndiver]

Dear members of WH, I'm planning to do the WHW in June and would like to have your experience, feedbacks, advices and suggestions on the equipment necessary for it. I realized that the equipment i've is perfect for hikes up to 3 days (as the Königssee tour in Bavaria, Germany, ~35km, that i made 2 years ago), but the WHW is clearly one step further, and will be my first experience for long distance trail.
I've seen the WHW webpage, that is quite informative, and few other pages.
I'm planning to sleep in hostels and B&B and follow the timing suggested by WH. I will have to hike alone, as the friend that was supposed to come with me recently had to canceled this project. It will be a way for me to empty my mind nearly immediately after my PhD defense.

Backpack: I'm considering to buy a 60L (possibly the Osprey Aether 60), to have an additional backpack bigger than my current 38L (Osprey Kestrel).
Waterproof Jacket (3rd layer): budget planned since long time for a membrane (GoreTex) jacket after a risky experience with an outdoor non-waterproof jacket. Any suggestion?
Trouser: i assume that only a single trouser is not enough? (currently i've a Fjallraven Karl Zip-Off, used in Alps and tropical regions)
Mid layer: considering to have two fleece jackets with me (one adjusted to the body, used for winter running, the second one more loose)
Base layer & Underwear: for 3 days hikes, i took 1 per day, with shirts that i use normally for running. For long hikes as the WHW, how do you deal with this point? Is there the possibility to wash clothes on the way? Which kind of base layer do you use?
Hiking poles: I guess strongly suggested? I already rented carbon poles in the past, but I'm horribly afraid about transversal shearing (aluminum poles seem to be less sensitive to this issue and just bend, but are a bit heavier).

I've heard that midge net is absolutely necessary at this period. Dry bags for the few precious stuff (as used on boats in scuba diving). Anything not obvious?

Thanks a lot for your advices to the novice in long distance that i am

[Dan Scheer]

Hi there,

As for the backpack, I would recommend you stick with your 38L one, if you get the 60L one you will it with all kinds of stuff you won't need. 38L will be more than enought to get you throught he WHW if you are not planning on camping. Going light is the way to go when it comes to long distance. A good rule is, if you don't have it, you don't need it! It is very tempting to take stuff you think you might possibly need, but never do, adding up to too much weight. By limiting the size of your bag, you make sure you only take what you really need. And the Kestrel is an excellent bag!
For reference, I walked 3.5 months with camping with the 48L kestrel!
(earlier I tried and failed on the WHW, simply because I took too much crap)

Waterproofs, very useful! My personal preference is the Berghaus Paclite kit (overtrousers and jacket), super light, stronger than it looks, very waterproof.

Trousers, one pair is plenty. Proper hiking trousers, like your fjallraven, will dry very quickly if it gets wet, so that is all you need really. Don't worry about it getting it a bit dirty or smelly, that is expected on a long distance walk, all places along the way will be perfectly fine with that.

2 fleeces is also too much, I would recommend two good base layers, quick drying and wicking, one midlayer (fleece or ideally polartec microfleece or the like as it keeps you just as warm and weighs less). That is pretty much it, the baselayers are quick drying, so every second day I would rinse one out in the b&b sink and let it dry, attached to your backpack, as you walk, then just keep swapping them out. You won't need to worry about getting cold, if you do get cold, just pop on the goretex jacket, it will trap the heat in and you will be fine. I have never been cold with that combination even on winter walks in -10 and more.... as long as you keep moving, but since it won't be that cold when you do the trip, you will be perfectly fine.
As for underwear, if you get proper hiking underwear, quick drying, wicking, anti-bacterial etc, you can get away with wearing one pair for 2-3 days easily, so same deal here, bring two, wear one, wash one, keep swapping.
I use Craft underwear, brilliant stuff! no chaffing, no discomfort!
Socks I would take 3 pairs as I tend to swap those more often, but that is mainly due to my feet being useless and blister prone!

Hiking poles are very useful in my opinion. I would recommend stashing them away for the uphill sections (good exercise for your legs and strengthening the knees), but use them for any downhill walking, that stuff is no good for knees! Also handy when you start to get tired, it is very easy to stop paying attention after a while and do your ankle in, poles can be great for quickly takign your weight off your feet if that does happen!
(attach a pole on each side of your pack and you can hang your clothes across them to dry!)

I would highly recommend drybags, first to keep your stuff dry of course, but also to keep order and allow you to quickly find your kit without having to take everything out. (get different coloured ones). also great for looking for something in your bag while it rains without getting everything wet.

I have never used a midgy net, as long as you keep moving, those little bastards won't bother you, but probably not a bad idea to take one, I always planned on trying one, so cannot give you any advice there really.

Other stuff I would always take:
- compass
- gaiters
- small sealable plastic bag for money/credit card (wallet weighs too much and takes up space)
- some paracord (attaching stuff to your pack, emergency shoe lace replacement etc)
- swiss army knife
- headtorch plus spare batteries
- kindle (evening entertainment)
- basic first aid kit (super glue, duct tape, ibuprofene gel, paracematol, blister plasters)
- if you have the space, some light shoes to wear in the evening, always a relief to get those boots off. the lighter the better. vibram five fingers are pretty good if you don't mind getting weird looks from people!

That is pretty much all you will need!

Sorry to hear your friend had to drop out on you, form my experience though, that may not necessarily be a bad thing for you, long distance walks on your own and a fantastic experience, you will be able to walk your own pace, are more likely to get in contact with other random people walking the way and it will give you lots of time to contemplate life

Have fun and good luck

[ndiver]

Dear Dan, what an impressive and complete reply !

For the backpack, i will trust you concerning the volume, especially as a friend had the same speech. I will have to check if my DSLR fits properly inside in case of rain, as during the hike, i'm keeping it fixed on the front of the bag (with a B-Grip travel kit).

For the waterproofs, you recommend both jacket and overtrouser? Did you had a rain poncho in your bag?

Concerning the trousers, even if i've to buy a second one (probably the same brand), that's a good investment (as i can also use them in tropical regions). And it's not an issue to get them dirty

For the fleece, in this case i will use the one i normally use for running. Maybe not the best product, but it was always comfortable in Alps whatever the conditions.
And big thanks for the explanations concerning the first layer .
Against blisters, i use the Akileïne Sports NOK cream, that i put on the sensitive regions of my feet everyday during hikes. Surprisingly efficient. I've tried before the Compeed products (and equivalent) after a blister appeared, the only thing it did properly was to kill my socks ...

Hiking poles, i used them in the Bavarian and Austrian Alps, but it's probably time to buy my own set.

If the midges are as annoying as the Brazilian black flies (that seem to not care of tropical insect repellent), that's worth to have a net !

For everything else, thanks for the suggestions (as dry bags), i've to check if the equipment budget will fit at the current point. Especially the waterproof jacket is a large weight in this budget.
Concerning the gaiters, did you had to use them frequently? It was mentioned by the website of the WHW. Kindle, as long as they will not provide the ebook with the physical book, i'm avoiding, but the weight is a constraint during travels.

Hiking at his own pace is something i enjoyed, also because i've my camera and the trend to regularly stop to shoot. When i hiked in the Alps, i've always met on the way random people, and each evening was full of tales, of schnapps, of joy, because all the persons that were in the hut had to cross the same to arrive at this point (several hours of walk).
But i'm bit sad to do it alone, because i was really hoping to hike with this friend (that i've not seen since long time), but which had to cancel for positive reasons, so I'm happy for my friend but sad to do that alone.

Thanks a lot !

[Mal Grey]

Dan's list is pretty comprehensive.

To it I might add insect repellent (Smidge is recommended), so you don't have to wear the midge net unless they're really bad, and perhaps a "bothy bag" emergency shelter.

I'm sure you have suitable footwear from your previous trips, but these are perhaps the most important part of your kit.

[Dan Scheer]

Happy to help ndiver, long distance walking is one of my favourite things to do
Everything I said though is just my opinion though and I am in no way an expert, still got lots to learn myself!

I got a proper DSLR when I started hiking because I wanted nice photos, then I started to doing longer and harder walks and downgraded to point and click again for the weight saving. If you are not camping though, the weight you save by not having to carry all that stuff you can easily take a good camera along!

I would recommend both jacket and trousers, I have had mine for a few years now, never reproofed them and wore them all day long for days on end in heavy downpours, never got wet!
They are expensive but in my opinion well worth it. They are also stronger than they look! I did put an ice axe through my trousers but fixed it easily with a goretex patch for a few quid.
Never been a fan of ponchos myself, but like so many things everyone has different preferences

Absolutely, hiking trousers are never wasted, it's the only type of trousers I still wear these days (I am so happy I get away with wearing them to work haha)

Absolutely agree on compeed! It was one of the many mistakes I made and learned from on my first long walks. I thought compeed was the way to go... fantastic initially until it ruins your socks and then causes them to give you even more blisters ... and good hiking socks ain't cheap either! I use a similar footcream now too!

No experience with those Brazilian flies but they are most certainly annoying. Never had much luck with insect repellents, even smidge, but maybe that is just me, those little bastards seem to like me far too much! Another reason I stopped using repellents is because I mainly wild camp and showers can be rare, so trying to avoid anything that makes my skin even more sticky May be worth trying though if you get to have a proper shower in the evenings!

I use gaiters pretty much every time I go walking. Some love them, some hate them. I use them because I try to get away with taking a minimal amount of clothes, so while they are mainly useful if you need to trudge through snow or bogs, I also find them good for wearing on even good paths that may still be wet from the previous days rain or walking thorugh wet grass to keep the bottom of the trousers dry and clean(ish). Don't need expensive ones, I would go with the lightest and most breathable ones you can find, they just need to stop the splashes, if it rains, you will want hte waterproof trousers anyway.

Haha, I was never keen on kindle or e-readers in general until I got into long distance walking. I love reading but I cannot get myself to carry books, they are just too heavy!

Definitely agree with Mal Greys comment about footwear, shoes can make or break your trip

The experiences you describe about hiking in the Alps is exactly what I like about these sort of walks, all the random encounters with usually like-minded people!I am sure you will have a great time on this walk

[ndiver]

@Mal: Yes, his list greatly helped me
For the bothy bag, i discover that with your message.

For footwear, I guess that my boots Jack Wolfskin (with membrane Texapore3) are more than enough (went up to nearly 3500m with it), associated to different sets of hiking socks (all previously tested on the field). That's why i did not mentioned them in my first post, it's maybe the part where i'm the more confident.
As i mentioned in my previous message, i use the Nok cream to limit the friction. Excellent product, strongly reduce the risk of blisters.

@Dan: my good old DSLR will come with me, no way to let it home
In reality, i was considering last year to switch back to an Olympus TG3 water-resistant compact, but the quality is still so low that I'm waiting future improvement of rugged compact cameras (the new TG4 proposes RAW format, that i use on my DSLR, that's already a small step in th good direction).

For the jacket, i was looking to the Arc'teryx Beta AR, but the price is expensive considering the low usage i've of this type of jackets (more or less twice a year currently, but sometime over 3000m).
A friend with who i previously hiked use both hardshell and poncho when mountaineering, depending of the situation (also the poncho protects the bag).

For the repellent, past experience in tropical regions told me it's useful, if not necessary, even when you can't shower. Last trip in Brazil (I'm biologist), we all came back with 50 to 100 bites of these blackflies, only on legs and feet ... mosquitoes were less annoying, and both transmit diseases. Stingless bees are also annoying, but not dangerous (they come on us for the salt, and get easily trapped in hairs !).

The book is a bit the issue

For the hike, still lot to prepare, including booking, to decide in how many days i do it (some consecutive steps of 15km can almost be doubled).

[Fairweather Softie]

Hi, I've walked the WHW twice now, always staying in B&B's or bunkhouse. First time carried a ernomous rucksack from start to finish, 2nd time used the bag service, 35 pounds I think it cost! The best money spent ever!!

Excuse my directness but if I'm staying in a B&B with a shower I would like to put clean underwear on. Your bag is sitting at bunkhouse, hotel or campsite every night so all you need is a daypack and you get the benefit of dry and clean clothes to wear each day.

My user name says it all Softie.

[EileanB]

I agree with everyone about the smaller rucksack, you can travel very light if you are b&b and hostelling it. On the Pennine Way last year my companion and I both managed comfortably with rucksacks round the 35litres, for 18 days of walking. I lived in a pair of lightweight paramo walking trousers which are waterproof, thus saving overtrousers, my friend had an equivalent pair which I think are haglofs, and a paclite jacket. Oh, and a pair of shorts, in case the sun came out. I took a pair of light walking sandals to go to the pub in the evening to give my boots time to dry out, and washed socks and knickers in the shower each evening, thus having one pair on and one drying. I took a spare set of clothes for the evenings, and weighed everything obsessively before packing it. Contents of the pack came in at under 5 kilos plus water and lunch.
We have done a few long distance walks together, and before setting off empty our rucksacks out and argue for the inclusion of everything that goes back in. Quite a few un-necessaries get chucked out that way!
We have considered baggage transfer, but as you need maps and waterproofs and maybe an extra layer with you anyway, we found we would save less than 2 kilos in weight. The heaviest thing you carry is probably water, and you can't leave that in the overnight bag.

[basscadet]

ndiver, I think ponchos are less well used here in Scotland, basically because it can be really quite windy, and a poncho can turn into a sail in seconds hence why waterproof trousers are the way to go - useful if the rain is coming at you horizontally
I wouldn't personally take half the stuff mentioned on this thread if I was staying in civilised places.. Its not like the WHW is some expanse of wilderness, there are shops/hotels/services every few miles, so easy to pick up what you need. I would just take my day walk stuff with a couple of spare pairs of socks and knickers thrown in..

[Caberfeidh]

How about your own personal airship (helium-filled , not hydrogen, oh no!) so that you do not have to do any of that tedious "walking" business, and for your evening's entertainment, a high-velocity rifle and a bottle of cask-strength malt whisky. Or even a cask of bottle-strength whisky. That makes for an entertaining evening, you just ask the denizens of the Kingshouse Hotel...

WHW Equipment

[ndiver]

@basscadet, @Fairweather Softie and @EileanB: thanks for the advices.

For the short, no need, all my hiking pants are zip-off, consequence of their use in tropical regions.

Even if i expect to stay mostly in hostels, I want to have my bag with me during the hike. I've seen that it's possible to make transport the bag to the next step, but i prefer to do it by myself, otherwise, for me it's cheating (the only time i used that was in the Alps, where my bag was transported by a small aerial lift between two mountain huts, because we had crampons and harness with us and had 1500m to climb during the day).
But yes, having one set of fresh underwear and tshirt for the evening is also probably a decent idea, and does not weight much.

For the poncho, a good friend used to mountain hiking suggested a poncho that also covers the bag rather than waterproof trouser, especially considering that I might not use often the waterproof trouser in future years and that a good one (GoreTex) is quite expensive, when the poncho is extremely cheaper and and versatile (the current one i have, that does not cover the bag, was used in Central America and in the Alps).

@Caberfeidh: totally agree with you concerning the need of a good drink !

[weebirdie]

Someone mentioned 'evening shoes' as when you take your boots off at the end of the day, you REALLY don't want to put them on again to walk to the shop / pub / whatever. I bought a pair of the neoprene 'swimming'/surfing shoes like these : http://www.amazon.co.uk/Aqua-Shoes-Adults-Childrens-Neoprene/dp/B009X8GCOS
(They do adult ones too)

They were brilliant! Featherlight and bendable, so you could squish them into the smallest gaps in your rucksack, quick drying (wore them in grotty showers a couple of times) but the tread was thick enough to manage tarmac and even the gravel along the side of the road from Beinglas Farm to The Drovers.

And yes, I also second getting a baggage carrier - you can then carry just what you need for the day in your daypack and you might have room in your big backpack for extra underwear (NEVER underestimate how lovely clean pants and socks feel after a lovely hot shower!). We used Gilbert at Travel-Lite and he was brilliant.

[ndiver]

For the Neoprene shoes, i keep in mind.

But the baggage carrier, i'm out. The WHW will be an outlet after a PhD defense, a way to disconnect, to not blast. That's why i want to do it with all my equipment in my backpack.

[Dan Scheer]

good choice!
each to their own but I know to me personally it just doesn't feel right to use a baggage carrier. There is just a special feeling to carrying everything you need on your back. It gives you so much more freedom

[Silverhill]

For the poncho, a good friend used to mountain hiking suggested a poncho that also covers the bag rather than waterproof trouser, especially considering that I might not use often the waterproof trouser in future years and that a good one (GoreTex) is quite expensive, when the poncho is extremely cheaper and and versatile (the current one i have, that does not cover the bag, was used in Central America and in the Alps).

Have a look at this topic:
http://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=48329