Goretex boots ... is it just me?

[paulm]

I've become increasingly disillusioned with the 'waterproof' qualities of this type of footwear. I still use a pair of 30 year old brasher goretex boots for gardening - they look absolutely wrecked ; split seams, broken fasteners, soles totally worn down, etc, etc - yet they are still waterproof and extremely comfortable. They've long ceased to be of any use for walking but even when used doing voluntary work at a local wildfowl and wetland trust - which was very very wet, they still kept my feet dry.

I no longer have a need for heavy duty boots and have tried many lightweight goretex boots but the waterproofing has been disappointing despite them only being used for easy dog walking type expeditions!

My questions are

1 - Has 'goretex' ceased to be as good as it was?
2 - Are other membranes just as good?
3 - Can anyone recommend a good, waterproof, lightweight but durable, medium ankle height boot for regular use?

Many thanks

[Mal Grey]

The problem is often that its so easy for tiny, almost invisible, bits of dirt/grit to get into the boot and onto your socks. These then get ground into the Gore-Tex via the lining, and can cause microscopic holes. With the advent of lighter outer fabrics, I think the modern boot relies more on the Gore-Tex, where older boots get more protection from the leather/fabric which is also proofed itself (wax/spray etc). So if you have these microscopic holes, the water gets straight through the outer in a lighter boot, and thus immediately to the holes. My theory anyway!

I have a pair of Salomons (can't remember model, similar to Quest) that were wonderful for 18 months, but now leak. Not badly, but enough. Fit and comfort is more important than the brand, and anything using Gore-Tex has to meet certain standards. Other membranes can be as good, I don't think their possible slightly lower breathability is as much as a problem with footwear.

The other annoying thing is that I find membrane lined boots take forever to dry once wet inside.

For my heavier winter boots, I stuck with non-lined leather, and never have any problem at all assuming regular waxing. Harder and harder to find such boots though!

[garyoppolis]

...For my heavier winter boots, I stuck with non-lined leather, and never have any problem at all assuming regular waxing. Harder and harder to find such boots though!

Seconded. A bellows tongue and lashings of wax/dubbin should see you right. I've tried membrane lined boots and find them sweaty and fragile.

[BobMcBob]

I tend to agree. I had an ancient pair of lined Brashers that stayed waterproof until the soles fell off. Finding a pair of waterproof boots today seems to be impossible. The last pair I had developed tiny cracks in the vibram soles that allowed water to penetrate. The pair before had a different type of sole but a very similar problem. I think they're just made from cheaper materials and not put together as well as they used to be. I stick with leather and make sure I clean and wax them regularly and that seems to be the way forward.

[Arthurs Eat]

I tend to agree. I had an ancient pair of lined Brashers that stayed waterproof until the soles fell off. Finding a pair of waterproof boots today seems to be impossible. The last pair I had developed tiny cracks in the vibram soles that allowed water to penetrate. The pair before had a different type of sole but a very similar problem. I think they're just made from cheaper materials and not put together as well as they used to be. I stick with leather and make sure I clean and wax them regularly and that seems to be the way forward.

You say way forward but really its the way back. In days of yore we had to regularly clean and reproof boots. I remember a product called Marrs Oil (spelling?). I dare not imagine what it contained But it stank. I used to put a coat on the old boots every night until they wouldn't take anymore. Certainly did the job though. I have a preference for leather boots just because it is usually possible to reproof when any lining is shot. I also used stuff called Snoseal? Anyone got any other interesting 'substances' they have used to proof stuff?

[Ben Nachie]

Back in the day it was Dale's Dubbin. Shifted to Nikwax in the '90s and still use it.

I found canvas/goretex boots to be pretty rubbish and always use leather boots with leather linings. Have experimented with trail shoes for summer.

[BobMcBob]

You say way forward but really its the way back.

I suppose everything goes in cycles

I always used to use Dubbin and have never found anything better. I tried Nikwax but it seems to eat stitching. These days, due to a worldwide Dubbin shortage, I use Granger's G-Wax.

I had an acquaintance who used linseed oil on his boots. I doubt it worked but he seemed happy.

[Arthurs Eat]

I had an acquaintance who used linseed oil on his boots. I doubt it worked but he seemed happy.[/quote]

No chance of woodrot setting in eh!

[Ben Nachie]

Linseed oil is/was commonly used to preserve and/or soften leather. It also waterproofs at least to some degree. It is usually cut with other substances like turpentine as it leaves a sticky finish if used on its own. Beeswax and neatsfoot oil is more common and is more waterproof. Beeswax is a major component of some well known branded leather treatments for boots.

[buzzard]

Any reason why you cant cover fabric boots in wax or dubbin?, I know it would change the colour etc but so what! if it waterproofs leather then why not fabric, just asking.

[BobMcBob]

Linseed oil is/was commonly used to preserve and/or soften leather. It also waterproofs at least to some degree. It is usually cut with other substances like turpentine as it leaves a sticky finish if used on its own. Beeswax and neatsfoot oil is more common and is more waterproof. Beeswax is a major component of some well known branded leather treatments for boots.

Well I've learned something there. Thanks. Beeswax is indeed the main component of G-Wax.

Any reason why you cant cover fabric boots in wax or dubbin?, I know it would change the colour etc but so what! if it waterproofs leather then why not fabric, just asking.

Leather absorbs the wax. It fills the pores in the leather. I don't think it would work with woven fabric, especially as the fabric is often coated with water-repellant stuff which would probably prevent the wax from sticking.

[Mal Grey]

Any reason why you cant cover fabric boots in wax or dubbin?, I know it would change the colour etc but so what! if it waterproofs leather then why not fabric, just asking.

Leather absorbs the wax. It fills the pores in the leather. I don't think it would work with woven fabric, especially as the fabric is often coated with water-repellant stuff which would probably prevent the wax from sticking.

Indeed. The wax soaks into leather, fills the natural pores and hence waterproofs it throughout the fabric. At the same time, it helps maintain the leather and stops it drying out. Using your fingers to wax them heats the wax and leather and helps absorption.
With "fabric" boots (slightly silly term, everything's a fabric!) whilst the wax may initially sit on the surface it won't be absorbed by the nylon/polyester fabrics so will just be scraped off very quickly. It will, though, help maintain suppleness of any leather/suede parts of the boots.

[matt_outandabout]

I think a lot of fabric boots are 'styled' to look cool rather than work durability. Every pair of light Salomons I've had wear membrane and outer at same spot. I've had Berghaus and Merrel that had line of stitching that wore membrane (then my foot) etc.

[Dunblane Bagger]

My old leather B1's were perfect, until I struggled to find a modern crampon to fit them, so felt I had to modernise to get a stiffer boot to fit 12 point crampons which were required for altitude climbing in the Alps.

I bought a pair of Mammut B2 gore-tex boots with the Crampon "lip" on the front and back, and they have been adequately waterproof when out and about in Scotland and cannot grumble so far,

However I do fondly remember plastering the snowsneal on my old leather boots, blasting them with a hot hair dryer to get the bees wax to melt right into the leather and then applying another coating of snowseal to make sure.

Never had an issue with lack of waterproofing, so modern isn't always best.

[paulm]

Firstly apologies for not posting back on this since I opened the thread (due to a combination of xmas nonsense, broadband fault and man flu!)

All of the comments/advice have been heeded - particularly that modern boots seem to be more (style than substance) the particular ( or most recent) pair that I was yarping on about are 'berghaus exterra light gtx' - they looked great, particularly with a pair of jeans. They don't look so great now because, when they started to soak up water like a sponge, I promptly layered them completely with clear dubbin. they are now nearly completely waterproof even if they do look like they've been stolen from a skip!

I'll certainly look into those boots mentioned in the thread before choosing my new ones -many thanks to you all!

Meanwhile - here's proof that they don't make 'em how they used to ... my now 'gardening boots' that I mentioned when I opened the thread ... they really are still waterproof!